[wiseguy]

John's take - Ignition coils

I am incredibly fortunate to not only have a Rune rider live 90 minutes away, but one who is experienced and willing to ride out to me to help. Big big BIG thank you to John.

We spent hours talking and testing. In a few words, here's what we observed.

1) Changing the new TPS's position (turning it) made no difference at all in the idle. Disconnecting it made it idle smoother.

2) The oil smells like gas.

3) The spark plugs I installed days ago are black on the right side and the sparks are weak.

John suggests changing the ignition coils.
After removing the covers,
I can't figure out which objects they are.
The photos in the manual are inadequate to distinguish them.

Here is a photo I took.
Anybody out there who can help with this?

 

[wiseguy]

ref pic on bottom of pg 1-28 of S/M---your red arrows from left to right...camshaft position sensor, No 1/2 ignition coil, and your turn signal flasher unit.

I take it the camshaft position sensor isn't fully together/connected because you're working on it? If not, that's not good.

Thanks. I put the clip back in after taking the photo.I was looking at 18-8.
Are these the cords that need to be disconnected to test the coils?

Pretty sure coil 5/6 is under the air cleaner cover. Didn't get to that yet.

 

[wiseguy]

Not to rain on the party... not sure this holds true from other vendors or Honda dealers. There are folks selling Runes because of not being able to get parts.

https://www.partzilla.com/product/honda/30510-MEC-003?ref=9343ba92c674af69a9f499ecd6110e60ef32dad5

That is absolutely terrifying.
I am seriously having a hard time dealing with this.

Back to my paperweight...
To test the coils requires disconnection and then use of a peak voltage tester
to the wire harness side connector terminal and ground. 18-7

What is the wire harness side connector terminal?
Does each coil have it's own wire harness or is there one of these?

 

[wiseguy]

Today, I did an oil change as Skibum said the oil had gas in it. Then I cleaned off the new park plugs.

I dug down deep and went WAY beyond by my skill-set, removed the tank bolts, supported it on 2 x 4s, and got to the ECM. After disconnecting the battery, I unplugged the connectors to the ECM.

It looked clean and dry but I used a spray cleaner and then dielectric grease.

I put everything back and started it up. Black smoke appeared after a few seconds of revving and then the FI light - same code...right knock sensor.

I'm ordering the ECM and keys tonight.

 

[wiseguy]

Eureka!

Greetings

For the sake of posterity...
To anyone who's followed my saga.

It took about three weeks to finally receive the ECM.
I cancelled an order from bikebandit.com. They said the ECM was in stock but,
after two weeks, I called and they said it would be another two to three weeks.
I ordered another from Partzilla
who matched a lower price from another vendor.

It was an ordeal to remove the ECM bracket out of the bike and then
carefully remove the ECM from the plastic bracket itself.

Slipping the new ECM into the bracket,
I put the bracket back in the bike, connected the battery,
and programmed a key. The locksmith didn't want to cut both
because he couldn't be sure it would work. He suggested to
try one and, if it worked, come back for the second to cut.

Which I did.

I returned home and started wondering if I screwed up the programming.
Following the directions, I programmed the second key.

I held my breath, turned the key,
and got click click click....
Trying the first programmed key, I turned the ignition
and also got click click click...

DAMN!!!!!
I must have screwed up the programming!!!

But when I tried to start it using the original key from the old ECM,
nothing at all happened.
So I'm thinking maybe the battery went dead.
I took out jumper cables and connected it to my jeep.
Letting it charge for about a minute,
I tried again.

WHALA!!!!

Started right up!
No smoke, no stalling, no flashing lights.
Turned it off, tried the other key, and also went well.

Turned off the bike, removed the cables,
and spent at least 30 minutes putting the bike together.
Took the bike for a ride and finally felt like it was healed.

It's now two weeks later and the bike is running perfectly.

So....
The bike went into BBS following a ride through a torrential downpour
the middle of July.
I changed the TPS, spark plugs, air cleaner, and did an oil change.
But the trick was changing the ECM.

I want to thank everyone who commented and gave me assistance.
Especially want to thank John - skibum - who took the time to ride out to me
and share his expertise.

Hope everyone is well.
Mark

 

[Skibum]

Greetings

ok the bike for a ride and finally felt like it was healed.

It's now two weeks later and the bike is running perfectly.

Hope everyone is well.
Mark

Time to bring that beast out to the woods.
Text or call when you want to see what NW Jersey has to offer.
Hot Dog Johnny's is open and Shades of death road is only 10 mins away :twisted:

:coffee1:

 

[wiseguy]

If you would? Could you please provide some information? Maybe with more data a pattern might show it's self and with that give owners some heads up of a possible future ECM failure.



2004
14,700 miles
Rode in a downpour.
Next day I rode, stalling, powerful gasoline odor from exhaust,
FI light came on.
Code indicated right knock sensor.

Tried the least intrusive fixes first.
Nothing worked until ECM was replaced.

After holding onto the old ECM for who's knows why,
I just threw it out so I can't give you the serial number.

Now my dang battery is dead!
Using a battery tender now and,
even though it lights up as charged,
battery can't seem to generate enough to crank.

Finalky decided on a name for the bike.
Murphy.

 

[wiseguy]

Time to bring that beast out to the woods.
Text or call when you want to see what NW Jersey has to offer.
Hot Dog Johnny's is open and Shades of death road is only 10 mins away :twisted:

:coffee1:

As soon as I get the battery issue squared away,
I'll text ya.

Thanks for your help!

Mark

 

[RaRune]

Anyone:

Does this look like a PGM-FI serial number... '9782-103245'...? I remember someone saying earlier that there was an updated ECM, but the model number on my ECM is the same as the one in the parts list everywhere I've looked. If the ECM had been updated, wouldn't it have a different part number?
Mine is 38770-MEC-674.

 

[phat6]

what NW Jersey has to offer

Potholes?

 

[wiseguy]

Engine number
Sc53e - 2002327

Build date is on the photo I posted earlier
10/03

ECM/PGM-FI UNIT I now have
38770-MEC-674


As an aside, I left my mostly dead battery connected
to a battery tender for several days.
Reinstalled the battery today.

IT'S ALIVE!

 

[DarkElfLusipher]

"Faulty" ECM unit in hand...

If anyone is interested in examining a "bad" unit feel free to contact me directly and we can work out getting it sent to you for all sorts of mad science experiments. It's just taking up space for me at this point and if someone wants to put some time into looking at it then they can have it.

I'm glad to be able to get out and ride finally after going through plenty of repair/replace troubleshooting up to and now including the ECM swap and re-key. The shipping was absolutely delayed on parts, especially the ECM, but at least these units aren't insanely priced or overly complicated to replace.

Let me know if someone wants something new to tinker around with!

 

[Afghanpilot]

If anyone is interested in examining a "bad" unit feel free to contact me directly and we can work out getting it sent to you for all sorts of mad science experiments. It's just taking up space for me at this point and if someone wants to put some time into looking at it then they can have it.

I'm glad to be able to get out and ride finally after going through plenty of repair/replace troubleshooting up to and now including the ECM swap and re-key. The shipping was absolutely delayed on parts, especially the ECM, but at least these units aren't insanely priced or overly complicated to replace.

Let me know if someone wants something new to tinker around with!

So.......the ECM swap was the cure? I’ll gladly take the old one for forensic analysis. PM sent.

-Ollie

 

[Artmonkey]

I’m an ass, but never the less hope this information helps someone.

APPOLOGY AND EXPLANATION: read this part only if you care. Please skip to next caps bit if you don’t

I posted in here a long time ago because I had the big black smoke. Shortly after Life changed and I lost my old log in info and I never tried to recover it OR replied with sufficient detail. Because I suck. So I’ve spent the last few hours looking for my post on a profile that I don’t even remember the name of, and it’s so buried that I can’t find it. It does not help that I am as computer illiterate as a wolverine on crack. I can’t appologize enough for that slip pf courtesy. But I am very sorry.

So here is my story and hopefully some useful data, very briefly.

THE USEFUL PART

I was gifted my very favorite possession by my old boss, who kept it outdoors...for five years. When I got it, I bought a corbin gunslinger seat and did a DEEP clean. Shortly after...THE SMOKE.

Someone on this site posted a very detailed process for replacing the throttle position sensor(TPS) and I wish that I could find that post for referance because it absolutely did the trick on my machine, until I washed it again. So I looked to that post for guidance as I removed the new TPS.

I carefully disassembled the TPS with a ballpeen hammer and discovered water stains inside. I’m no mechanic but clearly, water in electronics is bad. I took the TPS to a mechanic buddy who moonlighted at o’Reillys auto parts. Turns out it was pretty much identical to a 2004 honda-CRV TPS. So I imagined that they (Honda America) may have used the auto TPS (meant to be protected by an engine compartment and nestled into a full size auto motor) by mistake in the mad dash to get the Rune done on scheduleish.

I put some liquid gasket on the new TPS during installation and the problem has never repeated. I have ridden in fairly heavy rain, and just avoid spraying water at the TPS and not had the problem again for... four, five, [email protected]$& maybe six?...years.

As I said, I AM AN ASS for not posting sooner when my results where relevant, and never thanked the WONDERFUL people who helped me find the problem in the first place.

Thank you, whomever you are. I would not have my beautiful bike and I really really suck for not giving time back to the community that made keeping it possible.

THE TAKE HOME

-If your solution requires a TPS replacement, look to the 2004 Honda CRV’s TPS, BEFORE allowing Honda to charge you for a whole new throttle body. It costs $80 and an afternoon.

-Use some form of sealant/gasket to keep water out. This may not completely solve it for you, but better to seal it than not right? ��*♂

*I remember that the adjustment of the TPS was a little tricky and requires using a volt meter while twisting it under tension into the proper position then tightening it into place in that specific position. Again some big brilliant brain laid it all out in some magical post on this site.

-I suck

-Every one of you rocks.

 

[DarkElfLusipher]

It can't be the ECM!





:22yikes:

In before this epically constructive reply disappears to no longer be used as evidence of the existence of the elusive armchair mechanic


:beer8:

 

[Retired?]

So.......the ECM swap was the cure? I’ll gladly take the old one for forensic analysis. PM sent.

-Ollie

You ever get this old ecm? If so, can I get the serial number/data from it? Thanks

 

[Afghanpilot]

You ever get this old ecm? If so, can I get the serial number/data from it? Thanks

Nope, nothing. ;(

-Ollie

 

[Tripeulsix]

Hello all,
I come back to my BBS problem that I finally decided to solve ...

I will order a new ECM from Partzilla as well as the keys.

Can you help me so that I don't get my reference wrong?

My Rune is a 2004 NRX 1800 DA
The serial number of my ECM is 38770-MEC-673

Here are some pictures of the numbers on the keys, the fuel cap and the ECM.
On Partzilla this reference is replaced by the ECM 38770-MEC-674… is that correct?

For the keys I thought to take the reference 35121-MEC-811 ...
Is this also correct?

I hope this change will finally allow me to ride this fantastic bike.
That will change me from the 1000 CBX and the Valkyrie 1520 which are also fantastic.😇

Thank you very much for your help dear friends
Alain (from France)

 

[Tripeulsix]

For information, I have already changed the knock sensors as well as the TPS !
Thank you

 

[Retired?]

.